34 Shifting to Digital Marketing to Accommodate Customers - Laura Hanson Nov 11 2020

Greg Bray:  [00:00:00]Hello everybody. And welcome back to another episode of the Home Builder Digital Marketing Podcast. I'm Greg Bray with Blue Tangerine. 

Kevin Weitzel: Kevin, Weitzel with Outhouse, 

Greg Bray: and we are excited today to be joined by Laura Hanson. Laura is the marketing manager for new tradition homes. Welcome Laura. 

Laura Hanson: Thank you.

Thanks for having me. 

Greg Bray: I really appreciate you joining us today and having a little bit of time for us. So for those who haven't mentioned yet, could you just give us that a brief introduction? Who's Laura. 

[00:01:00] Laura Hanson: Yeah. So, I'm Laura Hanson. I am with a new tradition homes. We're a home builder in Washington state.

we build, we're looking a little over 300 homes this year been around for 33 years now. I think it's a family owned company and I've been there for 14 of those years. So, I started in sales and then I've been in the marketing role for probably over 10 years now. So. 

Greg Bray: So when you say a family owned company, are you a member of the family 

Laura Hanson: or are you adopted one of the few that, that are not, not blood family, but I've, I've become part of the family, 

Kevin Weitzel: families and what you make of it anyway, 

Laura Hanson: stepchild.

Kevin Weitzel: Well, that's the, that's the business side of you? What's the personal side of you? Give me once. I always like to know at least one secret about somebody we're talking with. 

Laura Hanson: Well, let's see, I'm married to my husband. Jason have one son he's 10, who were [00:02:00] living in the thick of homeschool right now.

So that's fun. gosh, something personal, you know, a lot of people don't know about me. I'm. I'm really into cooking. I'm obsessed with the food channel. and I garden a lot. So I'm basically like an 80 year old woman at heart and 

people were kind of, but yeah, it's been really fun. having time to do some of that with all this at home time lately, 

Kevin Weitzel: Greg and I have a personal bet.

And being that you came from Nike, or you, you had some spent some time at Nike. he says it's whoosh. I say that it's switched.

I'm just kidding there. Wasn't really there. Wasn't really, 

Greg Bray: I just won, what do you mean it's not a real bet. 

Laura Hanson: You 

Greg Bray:  

come on. How does somebody go from Nike to home building? What's what's that leap like? 

Laura Hanson: Isn't that funny? Um, yeah, you know, I, my background is in marketing and out of, out of college, I was.

I was really excited to get that at job at Nike, which I loved, but it was, a big commute for [00:03:00] me. And it was right before the big recession happened and I had some good friends that were, were working at new tradition. They were like, you're not happy there. You're not making the money. You want it to be, why don't you come over here?

We're just killing it, you know, selling houses. And I'm like, okay, get my license. And then. There goes the recession. But my, my dad's a home builder. I've grown up around that and in the building industry. So  it's just in my blood, like it or not. And I love it. 

Kevin Weitzel: Is your dad still a homebuilder? 

Laura Hanson: He is, he will not retire. He's in his seventies and he is in New Mexico and he keeps, he's just sending pictures yesterday is building another spec house. That's cool. 

Greg Bray: So, so Laura, a new tradition homes, who's kind of your target market and demographic that you're going after. What kinds of homes you guys building?

Laura Hanson: Well, you know, we've, it's always been fairly broad for us. We've, we've done everything. We do everything from first time buyer all the way up, to, you know, move down by our, so our price range is really broad. We're [00:04:00] at like two 50 all the way up to, you know, we'd done some at a million. we're getting a lot into multifamily now, even stuff that we haven't done before, but I say the biggest kind of swath of our buyers is like the move up, move down or retiree type.

Our second home is like our biggest portion right now. 

Greg Bray: And how big of a geography do you guys cover in Washington? 

Laura Hanson: So we're, we're based out of Vancouver, Washington, which is basically a suburb of Portland, Oregon. Two-thirds of our business there. And then we're in an area called the Tri-Cities, which is an Eastern Washington.

So, just two divisions. So we're not all over the state, even it's just to kind of central divisions. Right. And 

Kevin Weitzel: you've been in business long enough where you probably have people that have moved up, moved down and bought multiple houses for you guys, correct? 

Laura Hanson: Yes. I, in fact, I'm in my second personal New Traditions Home myself, but we have tons of repeat.

Family family buyers that are on three, four sometimes. Yeah. 

Kevin Weitzel: That speaks volumes. 

[00:05:00] Greg Bray: You, you know, that's, that's an interesting thought that I don't know that a lot of builders think about is the repeat buyer, just because home purchases are not that often. Is that, is that been something that just kind of happened or was there a strategy behind that that went after kind of the repeat buyer?

Laura Hanson: You know, I think, um, just, just the new tradition themselves, just having such a excellent reputation and name in our community that we've, we're just such a household name. And we've been here longer than any of the, you know, we have a lot of national builders that have come into our market now, but that didn't use to be the case.

And so I think that we just have a lot of longevity and quite a bit of a following, and, and just have carried that reputation. So people tend to get a ton of referral business and a lot of return business that way, which is awesome. No, 

Greg Bray: that's, that's definitely terrific. And I think it's a little unusual, so good.

So good job. That's that's terrific. So So Laura, tell us a little bit more, you mentioned a couple of different divisions. how do you structure your marketing team? And this [00:06:00] is all run from corporate, you know, individual communities have some play as well because different people do it different ways and we just like to find out, so how do you do it?

Laura Hanson: Yeah, so I, so I'm the, the marketing manager I'm located here centrally, As of the last couple of years, we've, we've brought on, some agencies and some outsourcing for a lot of stuff, which has been really helpful. I'm used to do it all in house, but it's just me. And then I have a marketing assistant in our region here and then another one in the other division.

So we've got two assistants and then a, recently have hired a marketing content coordinator who will solely focus on content. locally that will kind of travel around, and also kind of bridge the gap between our agency and other groups we work with. 

Greg Bray: Okay. And how do you decide when to bring agencies in versus, you know, what you want to do in house?

What's kind of your, your philosophy on that? 

Laura Hanson: Um, gosh, you know, it's, I did everything after it trial and error, I think kind of [00:07:00] realizing, and as things have morphed to, into being so much more digital, that's not my strength that I'm more of a creative brain. And so as, as we've grown, I I've just come to realize that we can't do everything and I can't do it well.

And I. I don't know that, that, you know, and as we've grown too, you just really need experts in all of that area. And it's really, really important. And so to have to bring on an agency, and, you know, an outhouse and so forth that can help specialize that and supplement the stuff that I know personally is not, my strength has been.

Amazing. It's been, it just allows frees up so much more time for me to do what I'm good at for our team to do what we're good at. And then too, it's like expanding the team, in a really economic way without having to hire it. 

Greg Bray: Oh, absolutely. So is there, is there just one agency, or do you have, do you go after those specialists, even within the agency [00:08:00] world, when you think about, you know, the experts where we have an agency who does this versus that versus, you know, the next thing.

Laura Hanson: Started out that way a little bit. and then as of a couple of years ago, we just moved over and we use group two. they just specialize in all things builders. So that's been awesome cause they speak our language in every area and we don't have to it's all just kind of centralized, which is really helpful.

Greg Bray: We, we love group two. We actually, just had a, released an episode recently with Molly where we were talking with Mollie Elkman so, so yeah, we're friends with them. They do great work. So, so you're in good hands, you know, that's terrific. So tell us a little bit about how, You know, again, we're, we're interested mostly in digital, uh, is, is kind of what our audience is after, but of course that's, everything's not digital, but how have you seen digital evolve in your time at new traditional homes?

You know, and how is that continuing to evolve for you? 

Laura Hanson: Oh, it's evolved so much because [00:09:00] even when I came in to run the marketing department over 10 years ago, it just was, it was very. Minimal, there was still billboards and newspapers and radio and all that going on. And that was a huge chunk of the budget.

And that is just not the case anymore. And we've really, seeing the benefits to that really pushed everything, on the digital side, maybe a lot faster than some of our local competition, because we want to stay competitive with, you know, the bigger builders, even when we don't have the budget. But, It's it's so digital now, and COVID has just put like the gass on with that too, 

Kevin Weitzel: implementing different digital tools, like on your website or in your whole process, maybe even in your sales center, what hurdles have you run into if any, as far as implementation?

Laura Hanson: Yeah, early on a lot of it was really cost-prohibitive for us in our budget and in our range. that's really not the case anymore, but early on, it was hard to. [00:10:00] Bite the bullet and buy into some of these things because it just, we, we weren't able to, you know, it was cost-benefit thing. any more, it's just, it's not, it's, it's a manpower thing.

And it's a, it's a buy-in thing too, because it's new, it's new for a lot of people in the company. And when we've had a lot of people, who've been around a long time and we've done things a certain way, and it's just, it's a different way, like with bringing on, we've got two online sales counselors now and, And that's just been a big shift in the way that we sell, internally digest that into our processes.

And, and, um, so that's been a little challenging, but, overall, when, when we see the benefit quickly than it, then we get to bring more in now. 

Greg Bray: So tell us a little bit more about your, you know, the implementation of your online sales, counselor, and program there. I know that's believe it or not, it hasn't been that long ago that a lot of builders didn't even know what that term was or what that position is.

And I think, I think that's grown, but I just saw some numbers recently from a [00:11:00] secret shopper study that shocked me. How many builders still don't have an online sales counselor? And I mean, Again, I don't sell online sales counselors. So I, you know, that's not my thing, but, but I just, I I'm still surprised at that.

Get you have any thoughts 

Laura Hanson: well, I, I can't say enough about it. I think I, I started doing it myself. I got kind of linked in with the group. Do you convert? I mean, this has been like 10 years ago and I was doing it myself up until probably four years ago when we brought on.

Someone else because it, it, it just keeps growing and morphing. And it's just, I can't believe that someone wouldn't, you know, utilize that because the buyers want it. They want, they don't come, you know, back in the day they would come take a Sunday drive and come tour the models and look at the signs.

And, you know, they just, they don't do that anymore. And so they want all the information upfront before, you know, they come out and so it's just really a customer service position if anything, and that we've been able to service our [00:12:00] customers so much better. And we also have a pretty heavy relocation, percentage of buyers.

And so they require more attention on the front side too, just with getting them information before they're able to come up and see us. And so, online sales has been really helpful, with those customers too. 

Greg Bray: Ha have you, did you have any challenges kind of. Getting buy-in to say, Hey, we need this different kind of position when you were first starting with that.

How'd you kind of navigate that a first time idea. 

Laura Hanson: Yeah. it, it, yeah, I I'll be honest. It wasn't always easy. there's always a little bit of rub between the traditional on what we call our onsite sales agents who sit in the model homes versus the online and it, it's just, it's just different and sometimes changes.

It's hard to understand. And so we, we, we did have some rub there. Sometimes we still do, but, but we're working really hard to get everybody on one team and kind of running like a, like a [00:13:00] machine. And it's, it's really, now that COVID has happened. And everyone's seen that, that for us, we were shut down for, for a really long time.

We're actually just recently able to barely open our model homes again. And so that's all we had was online sales. And so they've kind of proven their importance. 

Kevin Weitzel: You mentioned the, you know, the lack of adoption or fear of adoption from the actual conventional sales team. But what a lot of salespeople don't realize is that a properly implemented OSC is their greatest asset.

More so than an adversary. They're not competition. It's not like they're going to steal your commission. You're still getting a commission and your sale. They're just getting incentivized for loading more stuff into your, into your gun. If you will, they're putting more bullets in there so you can shoot more.

Laura Hanson: Yeah. And there, they're doing the hard work because I think people forget how many phone calls we get that are just not serious leads are buyers and they're, they're not, you know, maybe going to go [00:14:00] anywhere. And so these people are kind of feeling them out and kind of teeing them up for you if we know for the online and kind of saving that time upfront too.

So there really valuable part of the team.  I don't see that going anywhere. I just see, you know, we're seeing that real estate with the big things that Zillow and a lot of these companies are doing. I don't, I don't imagine that's going to be any different for us.

And so we want to be ready. To be able to service the buyers in every way that they want to buy going forward. 

Kevin Weitzel: Statement of facts. 

Greg Bray: How are you seeing what the buyers want change? When you say you want to be ready to service these buyers? What, what is it that, that you're watching for and seeing evolve there from the buyers?

Laura Hanson: They are so informed because they're doing research on their own, that just did not use to be the case they would call and really just. Barely be starting their search and need, you know, need to drive around and get all the information, see things. But now with virtual tours and interactive floor plans and everything online, [00:15:00] they want that they eat it all up and they, by the time, you know,

and by the time they call us, they're just like, I want this house on this lot and I'm ready to go. And it's shocking. Yeah, really to see how much work that you know, what they're doing, and that this is not just like millennial buyers. This is every buyer. you know, and, and, it's just been really amazing to see how quickly that shift has happened.

I would just say it's just been really rapid over the last four or five years. Some of that is us providing that content for them and letting them do that. I see. You know, not all builders are doing that yet. And, it used to be that you, you wouldn't, you don't put pricing on the site, hide everything, may come, come, you know, to your kind of a thing.

And that just frustrates customers. So we want to just put all that out there for them and let them decide. And then they call in they're ready. So they're farther along in the process when they get to us, which is, um, which is pretty cool. I, 

Greg Bray: I love, I love the way that you kind of differentiated [00:16:00] that, that some builders aren't doing that yet.

And so they may not be seeing the same result that you're seeing, but it's, it's kind of a cart-horse before the horse type of scenario. Right? You don't, you don't make the investment in some of these technologies. They go, well, nobody's coming to us already knowing what lot they want and what home they want.

And it's like, well, you haven't given them the tools to make that choice yet. And so how could they, right. And so you get stuck in this little echo chamber, I guess, or feedback loop that, that isn't. Really telling you what your customers want. So I kind of liked the way you said that.

Laura Hanson: Yeah.

Kevin Weitzel: And how do you keep the personal touch with all the virtual tools that are out there?

How do you, how do you keep it human? 

Laura Hanson: Yeah, that's a huge, that's a huge part of it. because you don't ever want to lose that. It's such a personal big purchase for a customer. And I think we have to be really mindful of that. And so we've, we're doing a ton of zooms like this. We were actually, we moved all of our design studios, online, virtually [00:17:00] right now, which I think is a little unique, but it's been amazing.

And we're just connecting this way a lot, a lot more, and we're just, we're just there for them with whatever they want, texting, emailing. we're doing just a lot of different kinds of touchpoints throughout the process, working on kind of setting up a system so that, or the build time is quite long right now because we've sold so many.

So just helping people stay engaged and, checking in with them. 

Kevin Weitzel: So are you using unconventional approaches to creating relationships? I E the title of your topic at the 2021 IBS 

Laura Hanson: maybe, we are, which will also be virtually now. Yes. Yeah. You know, I, for me personally, I've just seen the shift to digital and I, I see a lot of people go really hardcore with it and I think that's fine, but.

I know I'm still having a hard time buying into just like the chatbots and so forth. I've [00:18:00] read. That's why we brought in another online salesperson. I just want always people to have a real human on the end of the phone as soon as they can and just have somebody to talk to and connect with cause I know nothing is more frustrating when I need to speak with someone and you get.

A computer on the end of the line, or you don't get a response right away and people want to respond immediately. And we're living in times where people are really stressed out and, you know, home purchase is a big deal and we just need to really vamp up customer service. Our whole company has done that.

It's not just on the marketing side, on the sales side and construction side, just being more communicative and more responsive to everybody. 

Greg Bray: I think, I think that's a great insight, Laura, that buying a home is a high-stress purchase regardless in the best of times. Right. And I'm sure everybody's, you know, maybe it's just me, but, but my stress level, just the baseline has gone up quite a bit general.

And so you add a high [00:19:00] stress purchase on top of that, you know, you're, you're. Your comments of, we need to be more sensitive and more communicative and more engaging than ever at the same time that it's harder to do that because, you know, so we've got to, now we've got to take our game even to another level.

Right. And so that is, I think that's a great insight. And sometimes we just think that, well, I'll just throw all these technologies on the website and that'll solve it and they help. But, but there's still, we can't lose that personal touch as much as we can't be personal with people the same way. 

So when you, when you look at some of these tools and technologies and process changes that you've been working on and you're moving more online, what are some of the areas where you go, you know what, we're not quite there yet.

We still have room to do better. What are you kind of focused on as your next steps to make it even better than today? 

Laura Hanson: Well, you know, there's always, there's always something new. So I'm thankful that we [00:20:00] have partners that help us bring on, bring on that. But there's a lot of, we, we just entered, we just purchased a bunch of the enter now locks to do some of the self-guided tours.

although we're selling these, we call them our designer homes or spec homes so quick that I can't even get a lock on there to try it, try it out yet. But you know, we're, we're just kind of looking at some. Some new ways that we're going to be doing that. We're adding a lot of the interactive floor plans.

I think just letting people have a more immersive experience when they come to the site. So we'll kind of build that out, and probably do some more, Renderings and artificial kind of stuff for new communities. That's kind of one place where it's really hard for customers. When we have a new community where maybe it's in brand new floor plan, we've never built, or we don't have a Matterport tour to show them.

So we'd like to get into some of that. And digitally rendering out some of that stuff so that people can see it. We're not there yet with some of the new products. We have the virtual floor plans, but we don't have any of that. I would love to work on that in the next year. 

[00:21:00] Kevin Weitzel: And that's when I can help you out with that.

I don't want 

Laura Hanson: to have just the guy I've been meaning to check-in. 

Kevin Weitzel: We need, we need the shameless plug background music. 

Actually, I don't do it. I just sell it. I don't know how to do any of it. It's all still magic. 

Greg Bray: So Laura, an interesting challenge with what you just mentioned, you know, you're, you're trying to implement some of these technologies, but.

We're selling too fast that, that we can't even get it done. How, how do you avoid becoming complacent? You know, where, you know, we really don't need to keep investing or these times, because things are good right now, you know, which is crazy how good they are. And one side when they're so challenging on the other, but you know, any, any thoughts on avoiding some of that complacency?

Laura Hanson: Yeah, it's easy to do. It's easy to do because when things are busy and we're selling well if it's not broke, don't fix it mentality. But I think this is the time for kind of just shifting focus. And for me, it's been really nice [00:22:00] because although we are so busy in the marketing world, we're not as busy.

Pushing ads or maybe figuring out incentives or trying to fix broken communities. We're not doing any of that work that we do often. And so now has been kind of a time to slow down and do some innovation. And always just before we're thinking, when things that I think when things are busy, that it's time to forward think, and it, it, it seems counterproductive, in the moment, but I think we've learned over time, like with COVID happening had we have not gone through a big rebrand.

You know, last year had we have not launched a new website, how do we have not put in that hard work? That felt really, really hard in that moment. We wouldn't be, doing as well as we are today because those tools wouldn't have been in place and no one can predict pandemics or weird market shifts or anything like that.

So I think it just has to be scheduled in and it just has to be important and just has to be done. 

Kevin Weitzel: It sounds like you also buy into the philosophy of just because what's working now, doesn't mean it to work later. And just because it is good now doesn't mean I shouldn't be [00:23:00] poised in position to be aggressive when it is on that downslope, because every slope has a downslope or an offset to it as well.

Laura Hanson: So. Yeah, I feel that way. And I think, I think a lot of us who have been in the business a long time and went through the recession before and kind of have a little bit of that PTSD is still hanging on, you know, it's maybe a little reminder to not, don't get complacent, don't get off your, off your game.

So, so in some ways, maybe that's good. 

 Greg Bray: So, Laura, you, you kind of mentioned how much of your process isn't online, where, where they already are coming to you knowing the the home they want and a lot they want. And now your design center tools are, are moving online. What's your vision of when the whole process, the whole buy it all is just going to be there on the website.

You feel like that's here or too far away or never going to happen. What's your opinion on that, 

Laura Hanson: you know, I think it's. I think it's there for [00:24:00] some, and it's not there for some. So I don't think that it's a blanket approach where that's your only option for customers. I think even if this, I think it's coming, I I'm excited for it.

I would love, I would love to see it. I know it's just so far from traditional real estate that a lot of people have a lot of different opinions on it. Um, but whether or not. They think it's coming. It is in some form. And I think if we had that available right now that it would happen that it would work, it would really would work and it would be fun to test out.

And I hope to, I hope to have that available for customers, but with the personal, with the personal touches is not like a, you're not buying a house where you put it in the Amazon cart, and then you just, you know, this is people are buying an experience when they build a home. And so, That will be the challenge, I think, to figure out how to provide that quick purchase for them, but then to still give them the experience because we would never not want to give them that [00:25:00] experience.

Cause that's kind of part of the package. 

Kevin Weitzel: I think that with, with today's consumer, and this is a little more personal opinion than anything else. I understand that. And people like the simplicity and the convenience and the being able to just click buttons on their phone and order stuff up.

But. I am still a little bit on and I'm going to call it old school, but I don't think it's old school. I think it's just being human. I like, the the show. I like the dog and ponies and the, you know, show me the bling, show me all the stuff, and whether I can get it or not either my budget can determine that.

But, you know, I don't even care if my salesman's wearing a polyester leisure suit. It wouldn't bother me a bit. White patent leather shoes bringing on buddy, let's go. I want to buy a house. You know, I need that in my, in my purchase process. I don't know. Maybe I'm maybe I am a dinosaur. I don't know, but I just, I need that.

I need that personal touch. 

Laura Hanson: Oh, I think, I don't think you're alone. I think a lot of people do and whether the leisure suit guy is in the model or he's online. TBD, but [00:26:00] I mean, that's still part of the sales experience, and some people, they don't want to be sold, they just want to be helped. And so we have to really take it to more of like a customer service experience, but it's been really fun with the design studio because people are getting like the most, like it's amazing the, what we can do online now with the tools and photos and, you know, things we can show customers and they can sit on their couch and design.

You know, an $800,000 home and be really happy about it. And we mailed them sample. We still mail them samples so they could touch it and feel it even when they don't come in. But so they're still getting some of that, but, it's, it's just different. 

Kevin Weitzel: That's cool. Yeah. 

Greg Bray: So you talked about the idea that they're buying an experience.

I think we had a conversation with Jimmy Diffee from Bokka group. Not, not too long ago. I don't know if you're familiar with him, but, but he kind of went at that same idea that. That's one of the key ways that builders can differentiate is on their experience. You know, that, that a lot of the parts and pieces of the house are [00:27:00] very similar across builders, but it's the experience that you can really make yours.

Do you guys consciously focus on that as a differentiator? You know, we need to make our experience even better, or is that just something you're just naturally good at and just kind of happens accidentally? 

Laura Hanson: Oh, I, I think it has to be a focus to really do it well. And I think that that's something we've really been kind of buckling down on as a group over the last several years to really.

Whether it comes from we've we have a customer care rep. Now we have our warranty team. We've expanded. We do a two-year warranty, which is a year more than anyone else. And then a two 10 on top of it. So we've just kind of put in things, into place to, too. To make sure the experience goes well, but we're always working on it and we're especially working on it right now because we sold so many homes that people today aren't getting to start their homes until next year, just where they're, you know, slotted in the pipelines.

There's a lot of time in the, in the meantime for them to wait and we want to stay connect connected [00:28:00] with them and keep them happy and engaged in and as part of the process. So now we have another challenge on how we're going to make that experience good for them too, whether waiting. 

Greg Bray: Yeah, that's interesting how good sales creates a whole new challenge that you didn't have before?

How do we, how do we fill the quiet time? Right. It's all interesting. A new piece. We'll have to dive into that one on another discussion sometime. Well, you know, Laura, we really appreciate your time. I want to be mindful of that, but as we kinda wrap up, are there, are there places that you're looking and sources that you're looking at to kind of stay current?

What, where do you go for inspiration? 

Laura Hanson: Oh, gosh. Well, I mean, you know, there's so many great networks and, you know, after all these years of attending a lot of conferences and just getting tied in with agencies and, with, you know, group to an outhouse and a lot of these groups, there's so much great podcasts and con I mean like what you guys are doing right now, you [00:29:00] know, I feel like this there's so much good information out there now that that is so easy to.

You know, fine that it didn't use to be. So I always looked first for personally to, to our partners, you know, with online sales or, you know, working with, do you convert and, you know, outhouse group too, but, you know, linking in online and some of the social media groups to is really nice. There's so many good forums, out there for, for tips and trading ideas.

 Greg Bray: Laura, what would be one last big take-home piece of advice that you'd like to share today with, with our listeners? You know, if they only remember one thing from our conversation, what should it be? 

Laura Hanson: Oh gosh. to embrace all this digital stuff, even if it's uncomfortable because it's, I, I hear that from a lot of people in, in my, in my marketing groups that aren't, aren't quite there yet.

Maybe a little daunting and just, I would just say, find help, find good help if you can't do it yourself and, dive in now [00:30:00] because you don't want to get, you don't want to get passed up. And, it's, it's not as hard as it seems, and it's not as expensive as it seems either. 

Kevin Weitzel: And if you're at all concerned with being successful in times of crisis, then I would definitely recommend listening to episode 37 on group two's building perspective podcast with Matt and Molly.

That is your episode. And 

Laura Hanson: on top of that, if you're going to be signing up 

Kevin Weitzel: for the virtual inner international builders show, by the NHB. make sure that if you, you get that education pass and drop into the, humanizing the virtual world, the unconventional approach to creating relationships by Laura Hanson.

Laura Hanson: Thank you. Thanks. 

Kevin Weitzel: I'll ask, can we get ahold of you, Laura, if somebody wants to ask you some questions about how are they going to get all of you? 

Laura Hanson: Oh, you can find me on LinkedIn. It's Laura Hanson Hanson with an O with New Tradition Homes, or you can email me@lauradothansonatnewtraditionhomes.com. 

Greg Bray: Well, thank you so much, Laura.

[00:31:00] We really appreciate your time today. You've shared a lot of great insights and I think we're all gonna learn a lot from you. So thank you. 

Laura Hanson: Thank you guys for having me and thanks 

Greg Bray: everybody for listening and please join us again. Next time on the Home Builder, Digital Marketing Podcast. I'm Greg Bray with Blue Tangerine

Kevin Weitzel: and I'm Kevin Weitzel with Outhouse.

Thank you.